Title: Jack on Jack: In
a candid Q&A, the larger-than-life star of About Schmidt tells how he took
on a 'small' roll and started acting his age. No fooling.(Interview)
Date: 1/3/2003; Publication: Entertainment Weekly; Author:
Svetkey, Benjamin
Byline: Benjamin Svetkey; Jack Nicholson
There's a big bowl filled with ripped-up money sitting on Jack Nicholson's coffee table. Mostly it's shredded $1 bills, but dig around and you'll find a couple of torn 10s and 20s and even a crumpled piece of an old 50. "I have a long story about that," Nicholson offers, arching one eyebrow so high it practically qualifies as a hairstyle. "But I only tell it to people who rip up their money and put it in."
At 65, Nicholson has lots of stories, long and short, and mostly free of
charge. From his sprawling art-filled estate perched above
"People are talking about the film almost entirely in terms of Jack's performance," says director Alexander Payne, 41, who also made 1996's Citizen Ruth and 1999's Election. "I keep waiting to hear them say, 'Oh, and by the way, it's a pretty good movie.' But he's dominating all the discussion."
The discussion being held in his living room on this late afternoon in November is certainly all about Jack. About how he transformed himself into Warren Schmidt ("Unlike anybody I've ever played before"). About some of the other important roles of his life (including being a father to thirtysomething Jennifer, from his marriage to actress Sandra Knight, as well as to Lorraine, 12, and Ray, 11, from his relationship with actress Rebecca Broussard; he also has a son, Caleb, 32, with actress Susan Anspach). About his love of modern art (covering every available wall). About the women in (and out of) his life. And about how he's feeling now that he's reached retirement age ("Everybody mellows").
At some point, the $15 million-a-picture star may even get around to explaining why he likes to watch people tear up their money.
ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY Alexander Payne says he didn't give you much direction in About Schmidt. He says you just showed up on the set and knew exactly what to do...
NICHOLSON He only gave me one major direction. He said, "Jack, I want you to play a small man."
EW What's that mean?
NICHOLSON Well, the movie is about a normal guy who over the course of the film has everything he leans on taken away from him piece by piece. It's just one catastrophe for him after another. But because of Alexander's sense of humor, it's very funny. I looked at it as a silent comedy. So I sort of found myself standing on the set being Buster Keaton a lot of the time.
EW It's a pretty dark character, though. Did you find yourself getting depressed?
NICHOLSON Schmidt is a depressed guy and I was playing him 12 to 14 hours a day, so I did internalize the character. I let myself go completely physically. It was hard to look at myself in the mirror because I'd think, Shit, will I ever get out of this? But I didn't see any point to making myself undepressed after shooting a scene only to have to act depressed again later. So I just let it all go.
EW A lot of people are commenting on how low-key your performance is in this movie.
NICHOLSON I sort of un-Jacked myself. Because it's easier to involve an audience if they don't already know who you are--or think they know who you are.
EW By "un-Jack" you mean you toned down the eyebrows and the grin and all the other Jackisms? Was that difficult to do?
NICHOLSON This has been going on with me for 30 years. Directors are always telling me not to do that stuff. But you've got to use yourself as an actor. That's half the job. And what if I told you I've spoken with a different accent in every single part I've ever played? I mean, I haven't done an Englishman or anything that obvious, but I try to find a voice and a physicality for every character. I've played restrained and I've played unrestrained. I know when the critics are going to say "Look how over-the-top this maniac has gone this time." But I want to be able to have the freedom to do that, too.
EW At this point in your career, do directors still try to tell you what to do? Aren't you pretty much always the most powerful guy on any movie set?
NICHOLSON I always have a lot of little conflicts about how a movie is to be done, what decisions are made about various things. But I win very few of them.
EW That's surprising.
NICHOLSON I'm surprised too. But I've worked with a lot of great directors.
EW What about the actors? Can you sense their intimidation when you first walk onto the set?
NICHOLSON I do have to put a certain amount of energy into not being a sacred cow. It's not hard to do if you're aware of people wanting to treat you that way. You have to disarm them one at a time. There have been times when I've gone the other way. When I walked into the first rehearsal for A Few Good Men I knew that I was sort of the big fellow in the room and I went with it because it suited the character. But unless you're playing Jesus Christ or Abraham Lincoln or somebody like that, it doesn't help anybody do the work.
EW You've always seemed like you were comfortable being famous.
NICHOLSON Here's a good definition of fame. You call up a restaurant at six on a Saturday night and ask for a table for six and you get the table. Great to be famous. You get to the door and you don't have to wait on line. You get seated right away. Great to be famous. But from that point on you're going to be working. You're going to be the mayor of the room and will have to say hello to everyone who comes by. That's not so great.
EW So, you don't enjoy it?
NICHOLSON I've always sort of liked that there were two of me--the person people think I am and the person I actually am. I haven't really tried to fiddle with that using public relations. I never do TV interviews or backstage programs because I like to keep the mystery. As my dear friend Lara Flynn Boyle says, "We're here to entertain, not explain."
EW Part of that public personality is a reputation for being rather libidinous. You've always been pretty popular with the ladies.
NICHOLSON [Grinning] That has nothing to do with me being famous.
EW Fair enough, but it still sounds like it keeps you busy.
NICHOLSON A lot of what people think of me has to do with when I was younger. I did sort of burn it full blast. But that doesn't really exist any longer. I don't burn it at both ends anymore. I have to have more ecology to my personal energy these days.
EW You are a senior citizen now.
NICHOLSON Yeah, I'm a senior. I don't play the yellow tees at the golf course yet, but I'm taking advantage of it in other ways. The thing about getting older is that your character improves whether you want it to or not. Nature forces you to become a better person. And that's a good thing, especially for somebody like me.
EW What's changed?
NICHOLSON Well, I'm less libidinous. I'm not nonlibidinous, but I'm more weary and less tolerant of the dance. And it's easier for me to be alone now. I had to learn how to be alone. There was a long period of my life when I felt like I was going to run out of air or something if I wasn't rattling around in bed with somebody. But I've gotten more comfortable in solitude. I appreciate it as a luxury.
EW So, you weren't devastated turning 65?
NICHOLSON It was much harder turning 50. That landed on me like a ton of bricks. That's when I really realized my mortality. But I'd say 42 is probably the best age to be. You've been around, you've probably achieved some of your goals, but you still have all your physical capabilities. Although I ran into Sidney Poitier at the golf course the other day and he gave the last piece of good news I've had in a while. He said that you get a huge burst of energy at 70. So I'm waiting for that, hanging on by my fingernails.
EW Okay, here's something you probably hate about being famous: personal questions about your relationship with your dear friend Lara Flynn Boyle...
NICHOLSON I don't talk about that. I never have.
EW Well, there were all those reports in the press earlier this year about how the breakup with Boyle--
NICHOLSON Not by me. I didn't say anything to the press.
EW No, but your friends supposedly said that they were worried about you after the breakup, that you were losing weight and looking haggard.
NICHOLSON It's the one area of my life where none of my friends think I know what I'm doing. They think I'm goofy, a fool for love. And I guess I am sort of naive in the area of romance. Some relationships certainly shattered me for longer than the average person. But the thing about friends is that whenever they attempt to counsel you on these matters, it's always more about them than about you. They always end up talking about themselves. It's grueling. It's like, God, what about me?
EW It's hard to imagine you needing advice about women. You and Warren
Beatty marched through
NICHOLSON You know, I can tell you exactly when the sexual revolution ended: when TIME magazine put herpes on the cover [in 1982]. During my lifetime, I saw everything getting more and more open and free every day after World War II. And then Time put herpes on the cover and it's been getting less and less free ever since. We're in the cycle of less. Just ask any restaurant owner. It's been the end of public social life in America.
EW You've said the same thing about the movie industry--that it's been getting less and less open since the '70s.
NICHOLSON When I first started working at MGM [in the 1950s], they wouldn't shoot TV shows on the lot because it was seen as competition for film. They wouldn't even let their cameramen own TV sets--it was a stipulation in their contracts. So it wasn't very open back then. But now we're in an era of conglomeration. The guy who's head of the studio is a departmental chief these days. He's not in charge anymore. And the result is, Hollywood is making more children's movies because that's the only way to reach the enormous grosses. When I started, if a movie made 8 or 10 million dollars it was considered an enormous success. Today, that sort of money doesn't mean much. It's all about the huge grossers.
EW You've had your share of huge grossers. Batman didn't do too badly. And you'll be playing Adam Sandler's therapist in Anger Management in April. How'd you end up with a writing credit on that one, anyway?
NICHOLSON I didn't intend for that to happen. I was offered this wild part out of the blue, and the script made me laugh. And I thought it'd be a good way for me to learn this generation's comedy. I figured it would be a free ride, that I'd just tag along and learn. But then as I looked at the script more I realized I didn't really know how to play the part. I told Adam that maybe I was there under false pretenses, that maybe he didn't want me in this picture. But we kicked it back and forth and banged the script around for a couple of months. I didn't ask for the writing credit, but he's sweet about these things.
EW And you're about to start filming a comedy with Diane Keaton about a man dating a much younger woman who ends up falling for her mom.
NICHOLSON It's about love and relationships, about what is substantial in life, but mainly it's funny. It'll be my third comedy in a row. That's the luxury of where I am professionally these days. I can do three comedies in a row.
EW Speaking of where you are professionally, there's a lot of talk about an Oscar nomination for About Schmidt. That would make 12, tying the current record held by Katharine Hepburn and Meryl Streep.
NICHOLSON I don't know about that. I noticed when I passed Spencer Tracy and Laurence Olivier because that made me laugh. And also because my kids love that I'm in the Guinness book of world records. But that's the one area I think I've been very healthy about. I've always looked at the Oscars as a creation of public relations. It's good for who it's good for and bad for nobody. And it's a great night out, seeing everybody down there. Who doesn't like seeing movie stars? That's why I started working in the business.
EW How do you get that front-row seat every year?
NICHOLSON They give it to me because I'm so rarely on television. But, you know, you don't always get a front-row seat even if you're nominated. They don't put you in the front row if they don't think you're going to win. It's depressing. It's like, Oh God, I haven't got a shot! I'm in the third row!
EW One of those not-so-great-to-be-famous moments?
NICHOLSON Oh, I'm not complaining. I'd be crazy to complain. It's a beautiful life up here.
EW You have three houses here on Mulholland Drive, right? It's sort of like you have your own little compound...
NICHOLSON I see them all as one big thing. The one we're in now was the first house I ever bought. Then I started buying a few of the houses around it. One of them is tricked up for the kids for when they're staying over. And I have a couple of houses in Aspen, too. I laid out a much bigger life than I wound up living. Mostly I'm here.
EW And Brando is your neighbor. Do you ever bang on his door late at night and yell at him to turn down the music or keep his dog off your lawn?
NICHOLSON Last time I walked over he was listening to classical. He likes to play loud classical music.
EW The art here is pretty spectacular. Those two are Picassos, right?
NICHOLSON Yeah. I have about 600 or 700 paintings at this point. I have pretty eclectic tastes in pictures. But, you know, it's not bullshit--there really is a difference between a good and bad painting.
EW I noticed some watercolors in the hallway. Signed by you. When did you pick up painting?
NICHOLSON I started doing it with my kids, but it's only been a few years since I got to the point where I've been using my own paints instead of theirs. It's such a cliche--the actor who paints--but one of the things I've remembered from painting with my children is that I had some talent for it as a child myself. And I find it very restful. I do it a lot at night.
EW [Ripping up a $5 bill] Okay, what's the story with the bowl of money?
NICHOLSON One night years ago I was here with my friends Harry Dean Stanton
and the author Richard Brautigan [Trout Fishing in
Well, the next morning, I find some of the torn 50s on the floor and I just mindlessly put them into this thing here. It's some sort of candy dish but everybody always used it as an ashtray. For some reason, though, after I put the 50s in there, nobody used it as an ashtray ever again. Instead, people would always ask me about it--what's with the torn money in the dish? And I started to realize that I was creating a work of art. It was sculpture, as much as that Salvador Dali piece over there. In fact, of all the things that are in this room--the Picassos, the Francis Bacon, the Magritte--this bowl of money is the one piece of art that always draws the most comments and attention.
EW So, how much do you suppose it's worth?
NICHOLSON I don't know. I haven't counted it in a while. How much did you put in?
[QUOTE:]
"I've always sort of liked that there were two of me--the person people think I am and the person I actually am."
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